Internationale fighter ontwikkelingen

[Sparkplug]

In de laatste tabel zijn de aantallen opvallend: 34 Eurofighters, 28 F35's of 38 Super Hornets. Voor hetzelfde budget? Waarom niet dezelfde aantallen genomen voor een goede vergelijking?

Hier zal vast een gedachte achter zitten. Komt ook nog bij dat deze aantallen afwijken van de tot nu toe constant genoemde aantallen 24, 30 en 36.

Edit. Onderstaande uit het .pdf bestand op pagina 8 viel mij op.
"Another reason is that the Super Hornet is a two-seat aircraft, which implies a greater need for flight instruction hours and training of crews than the Eurofighter and the Joint Strike Fighter."

Blijkbaar keken ze bij de Super Hornet alleen naar de F/A-18F tweezitter en niet naar de F/A-18E éénzitter.

[StrataNL]

Vers van de pers: Denmark releases summary of why they selected the F35

http://www.fmn.dk/temaer/kampfly/Documents/type-selection-denmarks-new-fighter-aircrafts-english-summary5.pdf

F35 vs Eurofighter vs Super Hornet

The primary underlying basis of information has been the responses to the request for information, the so-called 'Request for Binding Information' (RBI), which was sent out to the candidates on 10 April 2014. At the time of the resumption of the fighter aircraft type selection
process, the Swedish fighter Gripen was also a candidate. However, the Gripen withdrew from the process when the Swedish authorities decided not to respond to the RBI. The New Fighter Program received responses from the suppliers of the Eurofighter, the Joint Strike Fighter and the Super Hornet on 21 July 2014. 

Taken:

National tasks   involved    with   maintaining  a  permanent   quick  reaction  alert  capability  which  can  perform tasks involving surveillance and defending sovereignty  and which can be scrambled with extremely short notice. Additionally, other national tasks such as supporting the Danish national police and other public authorities.

• International operations and  NATO's collective defence tasks with a fighter contribution on high alert state in which four fighters can be deployed for a period of up to 12 months every third year. In addition, periodic fighter contributions to NATO Air Policing missions.

Strategic aspects                     Military aspects                          economic aspects                                  industrial aspects
1. Joint strike fighter              1. Joint strike fighter                     1. Joint strike fighter                               1. Joint strike fighter         
2. eurofighter                         2. super hornet                              2. super hornet                                   2. super hornet
3. super hornet                       3. eurofighter                                3. eurofighter                                      3. eurofighter

In de laatste tabel zijn de aantallen opvallend: 34 Eurofighters, 28 F35's of 38 Super Hornets. Voor hetzelfde budget? Waarom niet dezelfde aantallen genomen voor een goede vergelijking?

[Sparkplug]

Over Super Hornets gesproken.

Boeing resumes Advanced Super Hornet push as US Navy considers fleet size

By James Drew, Washington DC | 11 May 2016

Boeing Defense has "matured its thinking" about the Advanced Super Hornet concept that it launched in 2013 and flight tested, revealing a scaled-back configuration this week with fewer stealth features and perhaps a greater chance of being picked up by the US Navy.

The new design, which would be mostly common between Boeing's F/A-18E/F Super Hornet and EA-18G Growler warplanes, is a mix of new capabilities and upgrades like the centreline fuel tank-mounted infrared search and track (IRST21) sensor, integrated defensive electronic countermeasures (IDECM) Block IV, and next-generation jammer that are already being fielded as programmes of records.

Upgrades that have not yet been adopted by the Pentagon include an active electronically scanned array radar (AESA), conformal fuel tanks and an open architecture cockpit with a 48cm (19in) wide-area display.


Boeing

The proposal comes ahead of the Navy League Sea-Air-Space exposition in Washington DC next week, and amid discussions within the Pentagon about how many more Super Hornets and Growlers the navy actually needs beyond the 568 F/A-18s and 160 EA-18Gs that have already been ordered.

Boeing is also preparing to undertake an F/A-18E/F service life extension programme that would extend that carrier-based aircraft's usability from 6,000 flight hours to 9,000h.

The first Super Hornet to reach 6,000h will likely be inducted for overhaul later this year, and meanwhile, the lives of legacy Hornet types are already being extended out to 10,000h.

The US chief of naval operations recently told Congress that the maritime service needs 24-36 more Super Hornets to meet an acknowledged fighter capacity gap as the Lockheed Martin F-35 comes online six or seven years later than expected.

The navy currently maintains nine carrier air wings including a 10th "paper wing" to support America's 10 aircraft carriers, as well as an 11th Ford-class vessel that is not yet commissioned.

Each air wing ideally contains four fighter squadron with 44 total aircraft, and current F-35 production and Hornet recapitalisation rates would see two F-35 and two F/A-18 squadrons per air wing in the 2030s.

Boeing's vice-president of F/A-18 and EA-18G programmes Dan Gillian says based current orders – including the 15 added by Congress in fiscal year 2015 defence budget and the dozen more included in FY2016 – continues Super Hornet production in St Louis, Missouri through mid-2018 at a rate of two aircraft per month.

The congressional defence committees have moved to fund 16 more F/A-18 units as part of the FY2017 budget (14 more than requested) and Gillian remains confident of a near-term deal with Kuwait.

The Super Hornet executive says that while the navy has a nearer term need for 24-36 aircraft, Boeing's analysis suggests that "about 100" more aircraft will be needed long-term.

As the navy considers if it needs more Growlers beyond the five to seven aircraft currently employed by each carrier air wing, Gillian suggests that eight are needed per carrier air group to meet navy mission needs and perhaps even as many as "10 to 11" per wing to fulfil joint force requirements for airborne electronic attack.

The company sees long-term viability in its St Louis line as long as production rates stay above two per month. Gillian says assembly dropped to that floor rate in April.

Boeing is eyeing fighter requirements by Canada, Denmark, Finland, Belgium, Spain and Kuwait and is even considering building some portion of the aircraft in India if it were successful in that campaign.

Regarding the Advanced Super Hornet and Growler, Gillian says Australia has already expressed interest in the conformal fuel tanks for its aircraft, and by doing away with drop tanks, the electronic attack pods on the EA-18G will have a greater field of regard.

It terms of differences between the Advanced Super Hornet proposal put forward in 2013 – which included low-observable enhancements like an enclosed weapons pod – and the one presented to the media on 11 May, Gillian says "the biggest different is maturation of thought".

"Twenty-thirteen was really about how great can we make Super Hornet in some of those stealth areas?" he says. "That was a little bit more of a head-to-head discussion [versus the F-35].

"Twenty-sixteen is about complimentary capability and what does the carrier air wing need given the other assets like F-35, [Northrop Grumman] E-2D and Growler that are going to be out there."

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/boeing-resumes-advanced-super-hornet-push-as-us-navy-425221/

[Sparkplug]

Eens. Je zou dan ook uberhaupt meer coordinatie tussen de verschillende landen verwachten... al is het maar om bijv. ook gezamenlijke traningstoestellen in de VS te kopen of iets dergelijks...

Het is voor een klein Europees land als Denemarken gewoon niet handig als zij als enigste op het continent met de Super Hornet vliegen.

Alles wat zij bijvoorbeeld als F-16 EPAF land hebben opgebouwd, wordt dan behoorlijk teniet gedaan.

[Mourning]

Een Deense Super Hornet keuze zou denk ik sterker staan als ook België en eventueel Finland deze kiezen.

Eens. Je zou dan ook uberhaupt meer coordinatie tussen de verschillende landen verwachten... al is het maar om bijv. ook gezamenlijke traningstoestellen in de VS te kopen of iets dergelijks...

[Harald]

Ik heb de cijfers maar eens opgezocht. Is wel een oude factsheet, maar het zal niet extreem veranderd zijn.
Het Defensie budget in Denemarken stelt niks voor, slechts 2,4% van de begroting. In Nederland is dit iets meer: 2,85%.

https://www.oecd.org/gov/GAAG2013_CFS_DNK.pdf

Waarbij ook Denemarken een overzees gebieds(lands)deel heeft net als Nederland, namelijk Groenland. Welke eigenlijk (voor mijn gevoel) als ondergeschoven kindje gezien wordt. Er is daar de Amerikaanse luchtmachtbasis Thule (tevens radarstation) dus de Denen zullen zwaar leunen op de bescherming van de VS. De Denen zijn in 2014 voor het eerst daar geweest met een 2-tal F-16's en 1 als reserve kist, voor oefeningen !!
De Deense marine is met 1 schip wel permanent aanwezig in de wateren bij Groenland,  Knud Rasmussen OPV voor de Artic operaties. Deze klasse bestaat uit 3 schepen.
Het Noordpool-pool wordt in de toekomst, dus ook Groenland belangrijker. Stationering van troepen, materieel zal (denk ik) in de toekomst toenemen.   

Knud Rasmussen-class patrol vessel
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knud_Rasmussen-class_patrol_vessel

Royal Danish Air Force F-16 planes have deployed to Greenland to undertake an Arctic mission
https://theaviationist.com/2014/08/10/rdaf-arctic-mission/

[Sparkplug]

Waarom niet voor de SuperHornet gaan? Verder volledig eens.

Een Deense Super Hornet keuze zou denk ik sterker staan als ook België en eventueel Finland deze kiezen.

[Mourning]

Hoewel de Denen iets verder vooruit kijken met hun defensie dan Nederland dat lijkt te doen, zitten ook zij er flink mee in de maag dat ze gewoon harde keuzes moeten maken. Zo hebben ze bijvoorbeeld hun OZD opgeheven. Kiezen tussen de krijgsmachtdelen is iets dat ik al jaren propageer, maar het vereist wel veel vertrouwen in je bondgenoten. En daar zijn de Denen misschien nog sceptischer dan de Nederlanders. Het gevolg is inderdaad dat je met 3 krijgsmachtdelen zit die eigenlijk geen van allen wat dan ook kunnen klaarspelen.

Maar vergeet niet dat ook Denemarken al vuistdiep in dit programma zit. Zij zijn Level 3 partner, gelijk met Australië, Canada en Turkije.
Een Gripen kopen zou m.i. een goede zet zijn voor de Kalmar alliantie, maar de F35 is politiek gezien gewoon erg sterk gepositioneerd.

Waarom niet voor de SuperHornet gaan? Verder volledig eens.

[Mourning]

Ja, het is een trend die men in bijna alle landen in Europa kan waarnemen. Nederland en Denemarken zijn daar zeker niet uniek in. Blijkbaar gaat men ervan uit dat men volledig veilig is en er geen of amper bedreigingen zijn en is men, wederom, niet alleen in Nederland maar ook in de rest van Europa vooral aan het kijken naar de korte termijn waar men als burger zelf iets aan heeft... gevaarlijke tendens die al een tijdje duurt en waarvan je zou verwachten dat deze meer dan uiterst minimaal zou worden gecorrigeerd in de meeste landen na de Krim, Ukraine, Libie en de Arabische lente in zijn algemeenheid.

[Mourning]

Maar goed... vanaf een afstand er op kijkend vraag ik mij af waarom men niet voor de SuperHornet gaat? Situatie is vergelijkbaar met Nederland maar dan bijna alles nog een tandje kleiner omdat het land dat ook is: een structureel te laag budget ligt in de basis. Waarom men dan er niet voor kiest om in ieder geval een luchtmacht in stand te houden en bijv. wat meer op de landstrijdkrachten te focussen snap ik eerlijk gezegd niet. 24-27 SuperHornets kan men in ieder geval het eigen luchtruim bewaken en minimale CAS leveren. Maar daar zouden dan wel bijv. noodzakelijke investeringen in de Landstrijdrachten tegenover staan zodat men daar een volwaardige NATO-bijdrage kan leveren. Of men kiest voor de marine. Kan ook. Maar ik snap niet waarom men, net zoals dat in Nederland lijkt te gebeuren, voor het luchtwapen kiest...

[Mourning]

En net als in Nederland is men behoorlijk aan het navelstaren en komt het argument om zich vooral op de eigen omgeving te richten uit de hoge hoed van oppositie. Ik vermoed niet omdat men dat echt vind, want ik verwacht JUIST bij de twee linkse tegenstanders veel mensen die voor humanitaire operaities/interventies zijn, maar puur uit opportunistische redenen. Er wordt melding gemaakt van bezuinigingen bij de overheid, maar uiteraard wordt amper vermeld hoe weinig er aan Defensie wordt uitgegeven... Typisch...

Met dergelijke teksten ga je haast denken dat het budget van Defensie van gelijkwaardige omvang is als die van de gezondheidszorg, onderwijs en sociale zekerheid... verder van de waarheid kan men haast niet zijn.

[Sparkplug]

The recommendation, first reported by Denmark's TV2 News, will be followed by a public comment period of 30 days, said one of the people, who was not authorised to speak publicly. The final number of jets could shift during this period.
[/i].../...
News of the recommendation emerged as doubts were raised over a crucial parliamentary committee hearing scheduled for Friday.
.../...

Kunnen ze tijdens deze 30 dagen eventueel de belevingsdagen en de KLu open dagen bezoeken als ze een F-35A willen horen en/of zien 

[Harald]

In de update van het Reuters bericht wordt nu gesproken over ten minste 27 stuks van de F-35. Hopelijk dus niet maximaal 27 stuks.

UPDATE 2-Danish government to recommend Lockheed Martin F-35 jet -sources

By Jacob Gronholt-Pedersen and Tim Hepher | May 11, 2016

* Government to recommend Lockheed Martin F-35 jets -sources

* Denmark to buy at least 27 of the fighter jets -sources

* F-35 choice can be blocked by Danish parliament (Adds details, background)

COPENHAGEN/PARIS, May 11 Denmark's government will recommend the purchase of at least 27 F-35 stealth fighters built by U.S. weapons maker Lockheed Martin Corp, people familiar with the matter said on Wednesday.

.../...

http://www.reuters.com/article/global-aerospace-denmark-decision-idUSL5N1886EM

Net als in NL, is er veel roering in de regering en bij de politieke partijen omtrent de aankoop en ook de F-35. De kogel is nog niet door de kerk.

The selection by Denmark's minority Liberal government follows intense public debate about the cost of modernising the country's air force, but it can still be blocked by parliament, where opposition politicians are urging budget restraint.
.../...
The recommendation, first reported by Denmark's TV2 News, will be followed by a public comment period of 30 days, said one of the people, who was not authorised to speak publicly. The final number of jets could shift during this period.
.../...
News of the recommendation emerged as doubts were raised over a crucial parliamentary committee hearing scheduled for Friday.
.../...
Some of Denmark's biggest parties including the Social Democrats have raised concerns about the economic impact of fighter purchases at a time of spending pressures.

4 stukjes uit hetzelfde Reuters-artikel

[Sparkplug]

In de update van het Reuters bericht wordt nu gesproken over ten minste 27 stuks van de F-35. Hopelijk dus niet maximaal 27 stuks.

UPDATE 2-Danish government to recommend Lockheed Martin F-35 jet -sources

By Jacob Gronholt-Pedersen and Tim Hepher | May 11, 2016

* Government to recommend Lockheed Martin F-35 jets -sources

* Denmark to buy at least 27 of the fighter jets -sources

* F-35 choice can be blocked by Danish parliament (Adds details, background)

COPENHAGEN/PARIS, May 11 Denmark's government will recommend the purchase of at least 27 F-35 stealth fighters built by U.S. weapons maker Lockheed Martin Corp, people familiar with the matter said on Wednesday.

.../...

http://www.reuters.com/article/global-aerospace-denmark-decision-idUSL5N1886EM

[Harald]

Artikel gevonden, van 4 april 2016 :

Denmark's Fighter Selection Date Faces Yet Another Delay as Replacement Program Struggles to Lift Off

Denmark's headline military procurement project – the replacement of the Royal Danish Air Force (RDAF) fleet of F-16s – faces a potential delay in the selection timeline laid out by the country's minority government.  The Danish Ministry of Defense is currently examining a short list of future fighter alternatives that include the Lockheed Martin F-35A Lightning II, the Eurofighter Typhoon, and the Boeing F/A-18 Super Hornet.

One looming hurdle to meeting the 2016 selection target date involves financing the project.  With a cross-party funding agreement required in order to move forward with the program, the underlying issue becomes defining the exact number of fighters to procure.

The Danish MoD's Project Office has already laid out several options, including procurements of 24, 30, and 36 fighters – each proposal representing a drop from the original 2005 requirement calling for 48 new fighters.  That figure was ultimately amended downward in March 2010 in the face of dwindling financial resources and shifting operational goals and requirements.

Two leftist political parties – the Social Liberal Party (SLP) and Socialist People's Party (SPP) – favor purchasing the fewest number of fighters deemed necessary to conduct Denmark's airspace defense and international security mission requirements.  The problem is that the figure they have targeted is just 18 fighters, six fewer than the minimum proposal request.

The SLP-SPP preference diverges from those of the other main political parties, including the minority governing Liberals, the Social Democrats, and the Conservatives, each of whom prefers the 30-36 unit purchase option.

The unit total preferences threaten to be an unbridgeable divide for a fighter program carrying a price tag estimated at between $2.8 billion and $4.5 billion, depending on the number of aircraft purchased.  Swallowing such a significant price tag is made all the more politically difficult by the straitened finances of the MoD, whose budget declined by more than 7 percent year-on-year in 2015 and is unlikely to expand much under the next five-year defense spending agreement (the current plan expires in 2017).  Adding to the price of the purchase are the long-term operating and maintenance costs over the life of the aircraft – estimated to be between $10-$13 billion across a 30-40-year period.

Furthermore, many opposition parties are adamantly opposed to using sources outside the national budget, such as international loans, in order to finance the procurement, meaning whatever funding is required must come from a Danish national budget carefully managed over the past three fiscal years to avoid exceeding the European Union's deficit threshold of 3 percent of GDP.

Public spending cuts and a listless economy have shrunk the political appetite for a large fighter purchase, particularly among the left-leaning parties like the SPP, who see large, expensive military projects as draining limited government resources better allocated toward health care, child care, education, and public transportation.  At a time when funding pressures are placing all government ministries in a financial straightjacket, these parties contend that resources are better allocated internally and that the armed forces' missions abroad should be curtailed.  Rather than participating in every EU- or NATO-led peacekeeping mission, they argue, the military should focus more on homeland defense, which would lessen the need for a larger number of new fighters.

The argument over financing looms larger when juxtaposed with concerns that the military budget may get overwhelmed by the fighter purchase, particularly at a time when the defense force hopes to upgrade its armored vehicle and artillery capabilities.

Because of the sensitive issue of ensuring that Denmark's defense force has sufficient funds in future procurement budgets, the likelihood is that the final agreed-upon number of fighters to be procured will total 24 combat aircraft.  Any additional RDAF capability requirements would then be met via drone acquisitions.  This seems all the more logical considering the suspected favored platform, the Lockheed Martin F-35, will carry with it an estimated unit cost of at least $85-$95 million per aircraft by the time Denmark would be ready to ink a contract.

Besides funding, political stability has been an issue for Denmark as it seeks to nudge the fighter replacement program forward.  A series of ministerial shuffling that has seen the MoD headed by three different ministers in just over two years has done little to help the decision-making process.

Adding to this is the precarious position of the minority government of Prime Minister Lars Lokke Rasmussen, which barely survived in February when the Conservatives threatened to withhold support and force a snap election unless Environment and Food Minister Eva Kjer Hansen was dismissed.  Rasmussen refused to remove his Cabinet member, who had come under fire over agricultural reforms, but the threat to the government passed when Hansen voluntarily stepped down.

Defense Minister Peter Christensen has stated to the Parliamentary Defense Committee that a fighter selection will not be revealed until all funding issues are resolved and an all-party financial plan is in place.  But besides cost and performance, another concern for Christensen and the government is the selected vendor's long-term support and industrial cooperation plans for Denmark.  Danish officials hope these will result in spin-off jobs and capital investments in Danish industry, as well as maintenance and servicing guarantees for the duration of the new fighters' service lives.

Denmark is a Tier-3 partner in the Lockheed Martin-led F-35 Joint Strike Fighter program and has invested an estimated $291 million in the project to date.  Many still believe that the fighter remains the favorite to replace the Danish F-16s.  Yet, a decision by Christensen late last year to decline providing the Parliamentary Defense Committee with specifics regarding technical issues concerning the F-35 raised in the Director, Operational Test, and Evaluation Office report for the U.S. Secretary of Defense was not well received.

While Denmark's preference is likely a U.S.-derived solution, an F-35 selection would certainly raise questions that the defense minister and government would not be able to evade.  But until the financials are worked out, it is a worry they can continue pushing into the future – just not too far into the future, as the RDAF plans to begin phasing the F-16 fleet out of service between 2020 and 2024.

So, chalk up yet another issue confronting the Danish Defense Ministry as it seeks to finally nail down a selection – a selection originally planned for April 2009 that has been delayed five times, with the very real possibility that a sixth delay awaits.

http://blog.forecastinternational.com/wordpress/denmarks-fighter-selection-date-faces-yet-another-delay-as-replacement-program-struggles-to-lift-off/