Internationale pantservoertuigen APC IFV ontwikkelingen

Gestart door Harald, 17/07/2018 | 10:45 uur

Sparkplug

@2805662 (Gregory Knowles, 06-10-2020)

Citaat@RheinmetallAus @boxercrv @lynxifv movements. fb

Klik op foto voor vergroting.






https://twitter.com/2805662/status/1313423136113651715
A fighter without a gun . . . is like an airplane without a wing.

-- Brigadier General Robin Olds, USAF.

Harald

Two bidders make the cut in Bulgarian IFV programme

Proposals from General Dynamics European Land Systems (GDELS) and Patria have been downselected for the second phase of the Bulgarian 8x8 IFV procurement programme.

The Bulgarian MoD selected the Patria AMVxp (pictured) and GDELS-Mowag Piranha V vehicles, preferring them to the Nexter VBCI and ARTEC Boxer.

Shephard Defence ...

https://www.shephardmedia.com/news/landwarfareintl/two-bidders-make-cut-bulgarian-ifv-programme/

Harald

FFG from Germany unveils Genesis 8x8 armored vehicle with hybrid diesel-electric drive system

According to information released on Linkedin by the German company Flensburger Fahrzeugbau Gesellschaft (FFG), the company has unveiled its new 8x8 armored vehicle technology demonstrator called Genesis, fitted with a fully hybrid diesel-electric drive system.

Today, several studies and demonstrator projects dealing with electric and hybrid electric vehicles were carried out in the United States and Europe, both in the military and the commercial sectors. Hybrid combat vehicles could provide many benefits for armed forces. Automotive performance of hybrid electric vehicles in terms of speed, acceleration, grade ability and stealthy operations is superior to the performance of mechanically driven vehicles.

Hybrid electric drive systems provide better fuel economy than their mechanical counterparts due to the use of optimum engine performance and energy recovery during braking. Energy storage onboard hybrid electric vehicles can support silent watch operations and also electric weapon stations such as directed energy laser weapons.

Citing the European Security and Defense Website, the new Genesis 8x8 armored vehicle technology demonstrator from the German Company FFG (Flensburger Fahrzeugbau Gesellschaft) was presented at the Förderkreis Heer Symposium "Current Challenges and Perspectives of Medium-Sized Defense Technology Companies as a Driver for Capability Maintenance and Technology Innovation" that was held from 22nd to 23rd September at the FFG premises in Flensburg.

The Genesis was developed to provide a modular concept similar to the German-made Boxer 8x8 armored vehicle using a platform/drive-line and a removable mission module. The vehicle is powered by a hybrid diesel/electric powerpack located at the front of the vehicle. Hybrid/diesel-electric propulsion is the technology where a diesel internal combustion engine drives a generator to produce energy for an electric motor in a vehicle.

The significant onboard energy storage system can be used to meet silent watch requirements for extended periods of time for various missions. Depending on the power requirements of the silent watch, a mission can be extended over a few hours. Silent mobility over a limited distance is also achievable where the vehicle can move in or out of hostile territory with a reduced chance of being detected.

The FFG Genesis Technology Demonstrator was configured to be used as IFV (Infantry Fighting Vehicle) with a Kongsberg unmanned turret armed with one 30mm automatic cannon. It has a crew of three including the driver, commander, and gunner, and the rear of the vehicle can accommodate up to 10 infantrymen.

Using the electronic propulsion, the Genesis has a cruising range from 40 to 150 km. With the diesel engine, the vehicle can reach a maximum road speed up to 100 km/h with a maximum cruising range of 600 km. It has a combat weight of 40 tons, with a length of 8.25 m, a width of 2.25 m, and a height of 2.40 m.

https://www.armyrecognition.com/defense_news_october_2020_global_security_army_industry/ffg_from_germany_unveils_genesis_8x8_armored_vehicle_with_hybrid_diesel-electric_drive_system.html



FFG Genesis Stealthy Hybrid-Powered Demonstrator

Germany's Flensburger Fahrzeugbau Gesellschaft (FFG) unveiled its stealthy hybrid-powered Genesis 8×8 tech demonstrator, shown as an infantry fighting vehicle (IFV) with Kongsberg 30 mm turret and 3+10 crew in flashy blue marketing camo. It has a modular design similar to Boxer, with weights between 25 and 40 tons possible. The model is not a development on customer order, but is intended to show the future of military vehicles. Genesis utilises a fully hybrid-electric propulsion system, which includes electric motors with reduction gears that are powered by lithium batteries.

Primary drive is by distributed electric motors allowing each wheel to be controlled individually, enabling skid steering. Total power is 1.368 kW with peak torque of 15.622 Nm per wheel. Batteries are recharged by a 200 kW diesel generator. Basic performance data is typical for a vehicle of that class with top speed exceeding 100 kph, longitudinal gradient of 60 and lateral of 30 percent. Overall range is given as 600 km at 60 kph, or 150 at 40 on batteries alone in "silent mode". This enables the vehicle to have permanent eight-wheel drive, with steering, acceleration, and braking controlled by adjusting the RPM and torque at each individual wheel station.

The model could also be used as a charging station for other e-models. The angular shape not only serves to protect against fire, but is also intended to keep the radar signature small and thus contribute to camouflage. The current version shows an armored personnel carrier. With two people in the ultra-modern cockpit with touchscreen screens, space for ten infantrymen and a soldier to operate the remote-controlled turret cannon of the Norwegian arms company Kongsberg for 30 millimeter ammunition. 13 people would then drive in the vehicle. The model that is now being shown at a symposium for army experts is 8.25 meters long, 3.20 meters wide and around 3.50 meters high. The pure driving module is 2.40 meters high.

https://militaryleak.com/2020/10/05/ffg-genesis-stealthy-hybrid-powered-demonstrator/

Harald

Citaat van: Huzaar1 op 02/10/2020 | 15:46 uur
Was al onderkent in Oekraïne conflict, het is duidelijk dat het echt heel dreigend wordt, er zal inderdaad iets gaan gebeuren. Met name lunabev bij eenheden zal beter moeten. Unerhaubt aandacht krijgen,

Er was/is altijd sprake geweest dat er samen opgetrokken werd met onze Oosterburen, dit nog steeds het geval ?

zie onderstaande posting

Citaat van: Harald op 30/05/2018 | 11:08 uur
Ik kwam onderstaande deel van een groter artikel tegen omtrent de luchtafweer ontwikkelingen bij de Oosterburen (Duitsland) en daarin werd ook iets beschreven over de ontwikkelingen samen met Nederland en het Apollo project.
Er wordt gepraat over als basis ; de Boxer als voertuig ! met 30-40mm kanon

Rebuilding Germany's air defence capabilities: on the eve of crucial decisions
https://www.osw.waw.pl/en/publikacje/osw-commentary/2018-05-17/rebuilding-germanys-air-defence-capabilities-eve-crucial

.../...

Very short and short-range air defence: rebuilding capabilities

Ambitious plans: meeting NATO requirements. As NATO has been refocusing on building up its collective defence since 2014, and in view of the new defence planning guidelines, very short and short-range air defence has been identified as a capability which the Alliance lacks. After a period of drastic reductions of these kind of systems over the last two decades, most allies are currently rebuilding their potential in this regard. Germany is very much amongst the laggards and needs to catch up quickly. According to some media reports, Germany is going to need around 20 batteries of very short and short-range air defence to protect the brigades and headquarters which Berlin has identified as part of NATO Defence Planning Process.[3] Other sources mention 14 batteries.[4]

In April 2018, work was completed on the tactical and technical requirements for the Bundeswehr's new very short and short-range air defence programme, the NNbS (Nah- und Nächstbereichsschutz). In 2018, Germany plans to commence tests of the systems available on the market. In 2019, the Defence Ministry will receive the Army's proposals for potential solutions and make its purchasing decision. According to the plans, the initial units should become operational in the years 2023–2026, in time to protect some of the brigades and headquarters identified within the NDPP. In the programme's second phase, i.e. to 2032, all the brigades and headquarters will get very short and short-range air defence protection. According to media reports, full implementation of the NNbS programme would cost around 2 billion euros.[5]


.../...

Rapid development of capabilities supported by co-operation with The Netherlands. Irrespective of the above long-term plans, the Bundeswehr is looking for ways to expand its very short and short-range air defence capabilities in the short term. Germany has committed to deploying a fully modernised brigade for NATO Very High Readiness Joint Task Force (VJTF) duty in 2023.[8] This means that its mobile troops need air defence protection against drones, low-flying helicopters and aircraft. For this reason, the Germany Army has been developing a smaller project known as 'qualified air defence' – in addition to the NNbS programme and independently of the Air Force.[9] By 2023, it wants to have around 12 base vehicles (plus surveillance and command and control vehicles) equipped with a 30–40 mm automatic gun for air defence protection for the German units on VJTF duty. The 'qualified air defence' project currently covers a single brigade but, according to the Army's long-term plans, every combat battalion should include an air defence platoon of this kind. There has been media talk of integrating the Boxer armoured fighting vehicle with different weapon stations (e.g. made by Rheinmetall or Kongsberg) and potential use of Airburst munitions.[10]

The German Air Force has also started air defence co-operation with the Royal Netherlands Army as part of the Apollo project launched in 2016.[11] It adds to the existing co-operation between the two countries' land forces, which includes, inter alia, the affiliation of two of the three Dutch brigades to German divisions, the binational 1 German/Netherlands Corps' headquarters and joint participation in the VJTF rotation and in the NATO battlegroup in Lithuania. The Apollo project envisages long-term and wide-ranging German-Dutch co-operation on air defence. What is particularly important from the point of view of current needs is that the project will also help the Bundeswehr complement its capabilities in the short term. A bilateral very short and short-range air defence task force will be created as part of the project. Moreover, in April 2018, German Air Defence Missile Group 61 equipped with MANTIS and LeFlaSys Ozelot batteries was placed under the Defence Ground Based Air Defence Command in the structures of the Royal Netherlands Army.

The Netherlands currently has greater potential in terms of very short and short-range air defence than Germany: the Dutch Army Ground Based Air Defence System includes 18 Fennek vehicles with Stinger launchers and two NASAMS batteries.[12] The affiliation of the German air defence missile group under Dutch command will not fundamentally alter its position in the chain of command of the German Air Force. However, it is expected to facilitate joint training and exercises with the Dutch units and enable a joint deployment in NATO's framework.[13] The aim is for the joint task force to reach full operating capability in time to participate in the VJTF in 2023. The Netherlands will most likely take part in VJTF 2023 with a mechanised infantry battalion among other units, as for VJTF 2015 and VJTF 2019. In the future, the German-Dutch task force may complement the capabilities of the NATO battlegroup in Lithuania as an air defence component. Germany is the battlegroup's framework nation (with around 700 troops currently); The Netherlands deployed a reinforced mechanised company (around 250 troops) to Lithuania in 2017 and 2018.

(4) Challenges. Representatives of the German Air Force point to significant risks facing the NNbS programme. Firstly, the time for making decisions is short (the plan is to sign the contract as soon as 2019), and the selected contractor will also have to implement the programme's first phase within a short period (2023–2026). Secondly, the assumption is that in the first phase, solutions available on the market will be acquired, which may mean that not all of the Bundeswehr's technical requirements will be met. Thirdly, financing the programme may be problematic: with a total cost of 2 billion euros, the NNbS will probably require an additional increase of the defence budget in the coming years. It remains to be seen if that is going to be feasible politically. And finally, it will be a daunting challenge to train troops within such a short timeframe. By effectively dismantling very short and short-range air defence within the Bundeswehr, and moving the residual capabilities from the Army to the Air Force, Germany lost the personnel that had knowledge and experience in this sphere. It has been argued that rebuilding this potential may take 5 to 10 years. In view of the German Army's difficulties in attracting personnel with technical skills, this may become a major soft spot
.

.../...

Huzaar1

Was al onderkent in Oekraïne conflict, het is duidelijk dat het echt heel dreigend wordt, er zal inderdaad iets gaan gebeuren. Met name lunabev bij eenheden zal beter moeten. Unerhaubt aandacht krijgen,
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion" US secmindef - Jed Babbin"

Oorlogsvis

Citaat van: StrataNL op 02/10/2020 | 14:04 uur
Was dan denk ik een oudere foto van de periode dat ze klaargemaakt werden om naar Jordanië te verschepen.

Denk dat je beter kunt investeren in PRTL 2.0 op Leopard 2 of CV90 onderstel met RBS 98/IRIS-T-SL ?
Toch moeten we weer naar zo'n systeem ...zeker met al die drones die tegenwoordig gebruikt worden. Je ziet het
nu ook weer in het conflict Armenie vs Azarbedjan  en recent/nog Libie , Syrie , Jemen

StrataNL

Citaat van: Parera op 02/10/2020 | 13:26 uur

Niet allemaal zijn ze verkocht als ik het goed heb. Laatst stond ergens een foto van onze opslag met PRTL's er in.
Was dan denk ik een oudere foto van de periode dat ze klaargemaakt werden om naar Jordanië te verschepen.

Denk dat je beter kunt investeren in PRTL 2.0 op Leopard 2 of CV90 onderstel met RBS 98/IRIS-T-SL ?

-Strata-
Je Maintiendrai! Blog: Krijgsmacht Next-Generation

Huzaar1

Citaat van: Parera op 02/10/2020 | 13:26 uur


Niet allemaal zijn ze verkocht als ik het goed heb. Laatst stond ergens een foto van onze opslag met PRTL's er in.

Zullen niet de beste exemplaren zijn.
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion" US secmindef - Jed Babbin"

Parera

Citaat van: Huzaar1 op 02/10/2020 | 11:19 uur
Nope, verkocht aan jordanie.

Niet allemaal zijn ze verkocht als ik het goed heb. Laatst stond ergens een foto van onze opslag met PRTL's er in.

Huzaar1

Nieuwe prtl kan ontworpen worden mits hij voldoende afnemers krijgt, ik denk dat een dedicated systeem te duur is. Aan de andere kant. Een toren is een doos staal, wapensysteem met radar ontwikkelen zal meeste kosten vergen en cv90 biedt net als boxer meeste ruimte voor alle electronica en munitie. Leopard2 is wel mogelijk in een jaar of 10. Dan komen er wat onderstellen beschikbaar.
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion" US secmindef - Jed Babbin"

Reinier

Citaat van: Umbert op 02/10/2020 | 12:04 uur
PRTL hebben we dan nog in opslag? die zijn toch allemaal weg naar Jordanie en ze straalde toch teveel als radar in gebruik was?
Volgens mij zijn er een 60 tal verkocht aan Jordanië van de 95 die we ooit hadden. Wellicht dat er een nog 30 tal in opslag staan? Maar die staan daar al sinds 2006 o.i.d.. Ik vraag mij af hoe goed die dingen nog zijn? Ze zijn al een 40 jaar oud en dan een 14 jaar in opslag? Loont het de moeite om die dingen op te knappen?

Umbert

Citaat van: Parera op 02/10/2020 | 11:16 uur
Oude PRTL's staan nog in opslag, prima interim oplossing.

Dat kan , Noren hebben NASAMS ook op vrachtwagens.

PRTL hebben we dan nog in opslag? die zijn toch allemaal weg naar Jordanie en ze straalde toch teveel als radar in gebruik was?

Harald

Citaat van: Huzaar1 op 02/10/2020 | 11:19 uur
Nope, verkocht aan jordanie.

Klopt, Duitsland heeft dacht ik nog wat in opslag/motteballen, maar heeft ook e.e.a. verkocht aan Brazilië.
Tja ... en gehele overhaul ..  :hrmph:  nieuwe sensoren e.d. met Leo2 onderstel. Gaat wel wat kosten maar wel een top systeem, denk ik.


Huzaar1

Citaat van: Parera op 02/10/2020 | 11:16 uur
Oude PRTL's staan nog in opslag, prima interim oplossing.

Dat kan , Noren hebben NASAMS ook op vrachtwagens.

Nope, verkocht aan jordanie.
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion" US secmindef - Jed Babbin"

Parera

Citaat van: Harald op 02/10/2020 | 08:58 uur
Precies dat is eigenlijk wat we moeten hebben een Pantsir S1/S2 of de oudere 2K22 Tunguska. De Russen hebben zulke systemen.
Je zou bijna de "oude" PRTL moderiseren en voorzien van AA missiele, ontwikkelingen/ ideeen hiervoor waren er bij Rheinmetall, maar nooit in productie gekomen. 
Anders maar eens met KMW in gesprek ?
https://www.kmweg.de/systeme-produkte/kettenfahrzeuge/flugabwehrsysteme/gepard-1-a2/


Oude PRTL's staan nog in opslag, prima interim oplossing.

Citaat van: Umbert op 02/10/2020 | 11:14 uur
Kunnen wij dat ook niet op een Scania vrachtwagen.

Dat kan , Noren hebben NASAMS ook op vrachtwagens.