Duitsland zoekt CH-53 Stallion vervanging

[Sparkplug]

Germany seeks pricing for 41 CH-53K King Stallions

By James Drew, Washington DC | 17 May 2016

The US government is preparing a response to Germany's letter of request for pricing and availability of 41 heavy-lift Sikorsky CH-53K King Stallion helicopters to begin replacing the 80 G-models the country currently operates.

Berlin is considering both the CH-53K and the Boeing CH-47 Chinook to meet its heavy vertical lift requirement, and the US Marine Corps is keen to take advantage of the better pricing that could be achieved by adding a sizable King Stallion order at the front-end of the production ramp.

The new model, which first flew in October, has twice the max gross take-off weight of the legacy CH-53G operated by the Luftwaffe at 40t (88,000lb) with external loads compared to 19t (42,000lb).

US Naval Air Systems Command's H-53 programme manager (PMA-261) Col Henry Vanderborght said at the Navy League Sea-Air-Space conference in Washington DC that adding foreign military customers achieves better production pricing, improve interoperability between allies and lower shared upgrade and sustainment costs.

"The Marines are buying 200 aircraft. Add another roughly 50 aircraft; that's 25% more and tremendous savings for the US government in terms of production costs," says Vanderborght on 16 May. "Beyond production, think about sustainment. Any new software upgrade, any new capability we need: if a foreign partner wants that too, we could share the development costs."

Vanderborght and Sikorsky CH-53K chief Mike Torok believe that Germany is the nearest term opportunity to add an international customer, and the next would be Israel, which operates 23 CH-53s.

The CH-53 users group includes the US Marine Corps, Germany, Israel and Japan, and those operators meet twice yearly to discuss sustainment, support and upgrades. Those nations are kept well informed about the CH-53K's progress.

Torok says Germany has not settled on an official programme timeline yet. In January, Flightglobal reported that Germany ideally wants to sign a deal in 2018 for initial deliveries beginning in 2022. Sikorsky says discussions have ranged from "40 to 60 or so" aircraft and a request for proposals is expected next year.

"We knew all along once we started flying and making this pivot to production that the interest would start peaking and we've gotten some requests from some other countries who are not traditionally CH-53 drives," he says. "The stuff everyone wants to carry is getting heavier, so the basic aircraft have just run out of capability, especially in very hot conditions where you have limitations."


Sikorsky CH-53K conducts first external load test
Lockheed Martin/Sikorsky

Boeing is upbeat about the Chinook's prospects in Germany, but as the CH-53K programme gathers momentum in anticipation of initial operational capability with four combat-ready aircraft in 2019, the competition is expected to be heated.

Vanderborght says the CH-53K is not a one-for-one replacement because of its outsized lifting capacity, and fewer aircraft means less overall force structure and personnel. Torok says Lockheed Martin-owned Sikorsky expects to build anywhere up to 300 aircraft and is preparing to add Germany at the front end, if needed.

NAVAIR recently put Sikorsky on contract for long-lead parts for the first two aircraft of Lot 1, and is working toward a Milestone C decision that will enable low-rate production to start in 2017.

Two aircraft are already flying, five are in testing, and another eight are at various stages of assembly. Sikorsky completed an internal production readiness review in March, ahead of a formal government review planned for later this year.

All 200 USMC aircraft are expected to be in place by 2029 to achieve full operational capability, with production ramping up to 24 CH-53Ks per year in beginning in 2025.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/germany-seeks-pricing-for-41-ch-53k-king-stallions-425387/

[Harald]

Last advanced Stallions up for delivery in Germany

Fifteen more years of useful service. In 2010, that was the goal of an Airbus Helicopters modification program for German Air Force CH-53G Stallion heavy transport helicopters. Over the past years, these green giants have been getting modernized cockpits, new avionic and warfare suites and countless other upgrades.

The end is near for the modification program, delivering fourty modernized helicopters to the German Air Force. They are known as CH-53GA, signifying 'Germany Advanced'. As it should.

In the Airbus Helicopters Military Support Center (MSC) in Donauwörth, Germany, well over a dozen Sikorsky CH-53s receive attention. Among them are the last of fourty of these airborne workhorses to be upgraded to CH-53GA. When done, the upgrade shows itself by no uncertain means in the cockpit, where avionics and communications systems almost identical to those used in the NH90 and Tiger attack helicopter, present themselves to awaiting pilots. All is contained in a completely new glass cockpit.

Miles away
With five multi-function displays, the new cockpit is miles away from the analogue workplace it used to be. "We're taking out all the old mechanical instruments and we put in multifunctional displays that provide the crew with enormous flexibility and increased efficiency", says Michael Hoofdmann, head of programs at the MSC.

A huge upgrade is the newly designed four-axis autopilot with auto-hover automatic flight control system that is similar to the NH90's auto pilot. An electronic warfare system for threat recognition and electronic self-protection protects crews in hostile environments. A forward looking infrared (FLIR) sensor turret is also part of the update.

Four decades
The first modernized Stallion was handed back to the German Air Force in 2012, close to four decades after the first of 110 helicopters were introduced in German service. Externally, the CH-53GA lacks the big fuel tanks that identified the past CH-53GS update, a program that mainly served to add personnel recovery and extraction capabilities. An internal fuel tank has been installed in the latest variant instead.

Fleet
The current German fleet consist of forty CH-53GA and 26 remaining CH-53GS helicopters, adding up to 66 in total. To examine the remaining service life, one CH-53G has been completely dismantled and inspected for signs of fatigue at Donauwörth. The fleet saw extensive use over the last decades, deploying to Afghanistan and Kosovo. In the same timeframe, all remaining helicopters were transferred from the Germany Army to the German Air Force. The NH90 took the CH-53's place in the Army.

Twilight
Updated or not, truth is the Stallion is in the twilight of its career. Berlin is looking at its options, being either the CH-47F Chinook or... the CH-53K. The 'Kilo' is the latest incarnation of the Stallion, seeing its first flight just last year. There is no road map yet for a purchase, but it seems likely the Germans will decide on a new heavy transport helicopter in the next two or three years. Deliveries are still at least six years away.

Until then, the CH-53GA is the tool of the trade when it comes to heavy helicopter transport in Germany. "They are now state of the art again", concludes Michael Hoofdmann. "No more upgrades needed for these helicopters."

http://airheadsfly.com/2016/03/15/last-advanced-stallions-up-for-delivery-in-germany/

[Harald]

Lockheed upbeat on possible foreign helicopter sales


Lockheed Martin Corp executives on Tuesday said they were optimistic about foreign sales prospects for CH-53K heavy lift helicopters and H-60 Black Hawk helicopters built by its new Sikorsky unit.

Such orders would help offset a slump in commercial helicopter orders triggered by the downturn in oil prices that has slowed demand from the oil and gas sector, Lockheed Chief Financial Officer Bruce Tanner told Reuters at the company's annual media day.

In Germany, Sikorsky's CH-53K helicopter is competing with Boeing Co's CH-47 Chinook helicopter for 60 potential orders, with Germany expected to issue a formal request for proposals in the next three to six months.

Sam Mehta, who heads Sikorsky's defense business, told Reuters that winning the German order would help lower the cost of the 200 CH-53K helicopters Sikorsky is due to build for the U.S. Marine Corps, and could help stimulate more foreign orders.

Mehta said Sikorsky could eventually see dozens of potential CH-53K orders from countries like Japan and Israel that operate current, aging models of the CH-53 helicopter.

He said Germany would need to pick a winner by the end of the year to ensure it could start using the helicopters as planned in 2018 or 2019, but the European immigration crisis had created budget pressures that could curtail military funding.

To facilitate any deal and ensure the participation of German industry, Sikorsky was exploring possible partnerships with several German aerospace firms, including potentially rival helicopter maker Airbus Helicopters, Mehta said.

Sikorsky has worked closely with the Airbus Group unit for a decade, providing logistic support for the UH-72 Lakota helicopter that Airbus builds for the U.S. Army, he said, when asked if Sikorsky could team up with a rival company.

Mehta said Sikorsky was standing by to work with the new Polish government if it decided to cancel a $3 billion order for Airbus helicopters placed by the previous government. He said Sikorsky had pre-built Black Hawk helicopters on hand if needed.

Earlier this year, a Polish deputy defense minister said the deal with Airbus was likely to be scrapped. Members of the new government have said they would rather see the deal awarded to a company that builds the helicopters locally.

Both Sikorsky and AgustaWestland, a unit of Italy's Finmecccanica SpA, have facilities in Poland. Airbus would source work on its helicopters in Poland, but the aircraft would mostly be built in France.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-lockheed-helicopters-idUSKCN0WI03L

[jurrien visser (JuVi op Twitter)]

Als Duitsland voor de CH-47F gaat (eventueel i.c.m. de CH-53K), dan kunnen zij de CH-47F Block II aanschaffen. De US Army gaat akkoord met het Block II plan klik

Wat een eventueel gunstig bijeffect zou kunnen hebben op de Nederlandse 20 in het volgende decennium

[Sparkplug]

Als Duitsland voor de CH-47F gaat (eventueel i.c.m. de CH-53K), dan kunnen zij de CH-47F Block II aanschaffen. De US Army gaat akkoord met het Block II plan klik

[jurrien visser (JuVi op Twitter)]

Ik denk dat gezien de grotere samenwerking met de Nederlandse LMB de Chinook wel eens als winnaar uit de bus kan komen. Ook prijs-technisch en qua capaciteiten denk ik de betere kandidaat voor de Duitse krijgsmacht. Staat tegenover dat men natuurlijk nauwe relatie heeft al met Sikorsky. Al is het feit dat de huidige CH53s niet door Sikorsky maar door Airbus zijn geupgrade mogelijk een teken aan de wand.

Het is afwachten het muntje kan beide kanten op vallen, al vind ik een split buy ook een attractieve optie.

[Elzenga]

Ik denk dat gezien de grotere samenwerking met de Nederlandse LMB de Chinook wel eens als winnaar uit de bus kan komen. Ook prijs-technisch en qua capaciteiten denk ik de betere kandidaat voor de Duitse krijgsmacht. Staat tegenover dat men natuurlijk nauwe relatie heeft al met Sikorsky. Al is het feit dat de huidige CH53s niet door Sikorsky maar door Airbus zijn geupgrade mogelijk een teken aan de wand.

[jurrien visser (JuVi op Twitter)]

Als we dan als landen toch samen gaan werken dan kan dit extra voordelen bevaten

Zeker, zolang dit niet ten koste gaat van de eigen voorraad.

CH-53K's hebben hun meerwaarde a/b van de Johan de Witt en/of de Karel Doorman, daarnaast zou sprake van synergie kunnen zijn tussen partners die een gelijksoortig type heli (CH-47F) exploiteren. (logistiek, training en onderhoud)

[Micheltje]

Als we dan als landen toch samen gaan werken dan kan dit extra voordelen bevaten

[jurrien visser (JuVi op Twitter)]

Kijken ze toch ook naar de Chinook.

Split buy zou natuurlijk ook nog tot de mogelijkheden kunnen behoren.

[Lex]

Past dit niet beter in onderstaande topic?
http://www.defensieforum.nl/Forum/duitsland_zoekt_ch53_stallion_vervanging-t27786.0.html

Dat klopt en daarom is het naar dit topic verplaatst.

Lex
Algeheel Beheerder

[Sparkplug]

Germany is moving ahead with an acquisition programme to replace its air force's Sikorsky CH-53 heavy-lift helicopters, with the choice narrowed to two types.

One key driver for Berlin's effort under the fledgling heavy transport helicopter project is the need to purchase a rotorcraft already in production, rather than launching a clean-sheet development programme.

Maj Thomas Knäpper, Luftwaffe capability manager in charge of the programme, says only two heavy-lift helicopters effectively meet that requirement: the Boeing CH-47F Chinook and Sikorsky's CH-53K King Stallion – being developed for the US Marine Corps.

.../...
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/germany-to-choose-between-chinook-and-ch-53k-for-hea-420964/

Kijken ze toch ook naar de Chinook.

Past dit niet beter in onderstaande topic?

http://www.defensieforum.nl/Forum/duitsland_zoekt_ch53_stallion_vervanging-t27786.0.html

[Ace1]

Germany is moving ahead with an acquisition programme to replace its air force's Sikorsky CH-53 heavy-lift helicopters, with the choice narrowed to two types.

One key driver for Berlin's effort under the fledgling heavy transport helicopter project is the need to purchase a rotorcraft already in production, rather than launching a clean-sheet development programme.

Maj Thomas Knäpper, Luftwaffe capability manager in charge of the programme, says only two heavy-lift helicopters effectively meet that requirement: the Boeing CH-47F Chinook and Sikorsky's CH-53K King Stallion – being developed for the US Marine Corps.

"We want to buy a product already on the market. You could assume that Bell Boeing would come back with the [V-22] Osprey, but it is not as big," he says.

Germany aims to take delivery of its first new helicopter in 2022, which means contract signature needs to take place in around 2018, says Knäpper. The service has defined its technical requirements for the programme, which should lead to the issue of a request for proposals in about 12 months' time, he said, speaking on the sidelines of the IQPC International Military Helicopter conference in London on 19 January.

No figures for the number of rotorcraft to be bought are available, but it is thought Berlin will look to match its current fleet of elderly CH-53G/GA/GS models. Flightglobal's Fleets Analyzer database records a combined 81 of the type as being in current active service.

As the helicopter will be used to support special forces operations and combat search and rescue tasks, an aerial refuelling capability is required, he says. However, Germany presently has no tankers suitable for the role. Although it is a customer of the Airbus Defence & Space A400M, the tactical airlifter is unable to perform in-flight refuelling of rotorcraft.

But Knäpper believes Airbus will have to overcome the issues with its flagship turboprop. "We insist on it [in-flight refuelling], so they will have to deal with the problem over the next seven years," he says. If Airbus cannot provide the required performance level on the A400M, Berlin may instead have to rely on tankers from allies such as France or the USA.

"But if we integrate the equipment in the helicopters from the beginning, it makes it cheaper than doing it later," he adds.

German industrial involvement in the rotorcraft programme is unlikely to extend to the establishment of a local production line for whichever type is selected. Although the predecessor of Airbus Helicopters assembled the current CH-53s in Germany, its participation is likely to be restricted to maintenance and support activities.

"The number of helicopters [to be acquired] will be too low, so it will not be efficient to build a new assembly line in Germany," says Knäpper.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/germany-to-choose-between-chinook-and-ch-53k-for-hea-420964/

[5m@sh_1up]

Ik weet niets van een verlengde Chinook. Behalve dan het experimentele model uit begin jaren '70, de BV-347. Weet de reden niet, maar blijkbaar niet beter dan de normale CH-47.

[Mourning]

En die verlengde Chinook variant die pas geleden voorbij kwam... is die juist voor de Duitsers niet bijzonder interessant? Wanneer zou deze versie kunnen worden geproduceerd?