Defensiebegrotingen en -problematiek, niet NL

[Ros]

In dat licht en in die van de financiële krapte vind ik het ook belachelijk dat men juist nu een Apache demo-team heeft opgericht in NL.

Er is al jaren een apache demo team.

Die in 2005 is opgeheven en dit jaar weer voor het eerst weer in actie is gekomen onder de mom "werving".

Waar het om gaat is het feit dat, als het huishoudboekje niet meer sluitend is te krijgen men moet gaan korten op de "leuke" dingen. Bijvoorbeeld korten op demoteams, sponsoring etc.

[HermanB]

In dat licht en in die van de financiële krapte vind ik het ook belachelijk dat men juist nu een Apache demo-team heeft opgericht in NL.

Er is al jaren een apache demo team.

[Enforcer]

In dat licht en in die van de financiële krapte vind ik het ook belachelijk dat men juist nu een Apache demo-team heeft opgericht in NL.

[Ros]

Als bezuinigen aan de orde komt is het de normaalste zaak van de wereld om deze fun and games grapjes als eerste overboord te kieperen.

He said the Red Arrows were "of great value to the armed forces and British industry".

Bull....... goh leuke show......ik denk dat ik maar bij de Infanterie ga ?.

[andré herc]

10 August 2010
Jonathan Edwards MP said the Red Arrows' £8.8m budget could be 'put to better use' An MP has called for the Red Arrows air display team to be disbanded and money spent instead on equipment for troops.

Jonathan Edwards, Plaid Cymru MP for Carmarthen East and Dinefwr, said the RAF unit cost taxpayers £8.8m a year.

He said: "Personally I think it is money that could be put to better use."

A spokesman for the RAF in Wales said the Red Arrows were a "flag-waver" and no comment could be made until the outcome of the ongoing defence review.

After asking a parliamentary question, Mr Edwards was told the Red Arrows provide "no direct operational role".

Plaid Cymru put in a Freedom of Information request to discover the display team's running costs.

Mr Edwards said: "We have to get realistic about public expenditure. I find the priorities of this government totally bizarre.

"I fail to see how cutting front line service, for example the £34m that is being cut from Dyfed-Powys Police Authority which represents my constituency, can be done when millions is wasted elsewhere.

RED ARROWS 2009/10
Pilots/technicians: £4.6m
Aviation, fuel: £1.2m
Dye: £400,000
Maintenance: £2.6m
Total: £8.8m
SOURCE: Plaid Cymru Freedom of Information request
"I for one would rather see public money used to ensure that police remain on the beat."

He added that he failed to see why the Red Arrows should be excluded from the debate about public service cuts when "the Welsh budget is itself suffering a £162.5m hit".

The Red Arrows, based at Scampton in Lincolnshire, use Hawk T1 jets, the RAF's advanced trainer.

Advanced pilot training using Hawks is carried out at RAF Valley on Anglesey.

The base's No 4 Flying Training School operates about 70 Hawks.

A spokesman for the RAF in Wales said: "There will be speculation about display teams.

'Thousands cheered'

"We're in no position to comment at the moment, there are too many things being reviewed."

He said the Red Arrows were "of great value to the armed forces and British industry".

"We will have to wait until the government's strategic defence review is published. Then we will have a better vision of what the MoD has in mind."

The spokesman said thousands of people cheered when the Red Arrows performed at Rhyl on Sunday.

The Red Arrows have held more than 4,000 displays in 53 countries since being formed in 1965.

bbc.co.uk

[Lex]

Jets, Subs, Armor Among U.K. Cuts: Report

LONDON - Large numbers of fighter aircraft, armored vehicles, warships and military personnel face the ax in a coming strategic defense and security review, according to an Aug. 6 report in a British newspaper.

The Daily Telegraph reported that it had seen detailed proposals to reduce the Royal Air Force's fast jet fleet to below 200 aircraft. The paper said the proposed cuts would hit the RAF hardest, but the Royal Navy and the British Army also face the elimination of major capabilities. The newspaper said the cuts, if made, would likely see Britain depart the stage as a major military power.

The new Conservative-led coalition government is looking to cut defense spending by 10 to 20 percent as part of a wider effort to squeeze public spending over the next few years.

Other proposals include scrapping the 120 Tornado strike aircraft and reducing the number of Typhoon multirole aircraft to 107.

If the proposals are accepted, RAF's fighter fleet will fall to the lowest level since the start of World War I, said the newspaper.

No mention was made of the RAF/Royal Navy GR9 Harrier strike aircraft, due to be replaced by Joint Strike Fighters. Many analysts here reckon JSF order numbers could be more than halved from the 138 aircraft the U.K. is currently committed to buy.

The proposals said the C-130 Hercules, including the modern -J aircraft, could be phased out, leaving the C-17 and A400M to provide the British airlift capability.

The paper said RAF personnel numbers would fall by 7,000.

The Telegraph said the proposed cuts for the Royal Navy included two nuclear submarines, three amphibious ships, more than 100 senior officers and 2,000 sailors and marines.

The report did not mention the two 65,000-ton aircraft carriers being built for the Navy. Those warships are widely regarded as safe from the ax, although analysts say it's likely that only one of the vessels will be used as a strike carrier; the other would be pushed into service as an amphibious support ship that would eventually replace the helicopter carrier HMS Ocean.

The Army could see 40 percent of its armored vehicles cut, including Challenger tanks, AS90 self-propelled howitzers and Warrior infantry fighting vehicles.

The report said the Army would likely lose a few thousand troops in the coming year to cut numbers to close to 100,000.

However, once combat troops withdraw from Afghanistan, an entire brigade of about 5,000 soldiers could be lost.

The armored brigades stationed in Germany are the most vulnerable, it said.

Prime Minister David Cameron said Britain wants to withdraw troops from Afghanistan by 2015.

The newspaper report said the MoD was also looking at moving control of the Royal marines from the Navy to the Army and grouping them in what the Telegraph called a "super elite" unit alongside two Parachute Regiment battalions.

Responding to the story, an MoD spokesman said the defense secretary "has made it clear that tough decisions will need to be made, but the complex process of a Strategic Defence and Security Review will be concluded in the autumn and speculation at this stage about its outcome is entirely unfounded."

The outcome of the review is expected to be announced at the end of October, along with the government's spending plans for the next four years.

Britain's defense budget is now facing a triple whammy. The existing equipment budget is already overcommitted by billions of pounds. The MoD is also facing further cuts of up to 20 percent over the next four years as part of the government's austerity measures.

The Treasury is also insisting the MoD budget bear the 20 billion-pound ($32 billion) cost of replacing Britain's nuclear-missile submarine fleet, rather than have the money provided by the government, as had been pledged by the previous Labour administration.

Defense News,
Published: 9 Aug 2010 14:06

[Lex]

Gates to Cut Major Military Command in Virginia, Officials Say

WASHINGTON -- The Defense Department plans to shed one of its 10 major military commands as Defense Secretary Robert Gates tries to pare billions from the Pentagon budget, officials briefed on the plan said Monday.

Gates wants to eliminate the Joint Forces Command, long a presumed target for belt-tightening, and will also announce Monday that he wants to cut the Pentagon's use of outside contractors by 10 percent next year, The Associated Press has learned. The Virginia-based command trains troops from different services to fight together.

Military and other officials described the planned cuts on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss Gates' plans ahead of a Pentagon news conference Monday.

Joint Forces Command, with nearly 4,900 employees and annual salaries of more than $200 million, is the largest single cut to be announced Monday.

Gates is not expected to say how much money will be saved by shutting down the command, which holds more than 1 million square feet of real estate in Suffolk, Va., and Norfolk, Va.

Savings will be offset by the cost of shifting some jobs and roles elsewhere. The Pentagon has already announced a target of cutting $100 billion over five years. And earlier this year Gates ordered a top-to-bottom paring of the military bureaucracy in search of at least $10 billion in annual savings needed to prevent an erosion of U.S. combat power.
Gates took aim at what he called wasteful business practices and too many generals and admirals, and noted that "overhead" costs chew up as much as 40 percent of the Pentagon's budget.

Big cuts are essential considering the recession and the likelihood that Congress no longer will give the Pentagon the sizable budget increases it has enjoyed since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, Gates and other defense leaders have said.

"The gusher has been turned off and will stay off for a good period of time," Gates said in May.

The current defense budget, not counting the cost of fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan, is $535 billion; the administration is asking for $549 billion for 2011.

Joint Forces Command, or JFCOM, is one of 10 full combatant commands. Most correspond to regions of the world, such as Pacific Command, but others are organized around a concept or mission rather than geography.

JFCOM lists its mission as training troops from all services to work together for specific missions. It tries to make sure equipment used by different services works together, and looks for gaps in capabilities within military services that could be filled by a specially trained joint force.

The command is headed by a four-star military officer, the highest grade currently in use. Marine Gen. James Mattis was its commander until named last month to replace Army Gen. David Petraeus as head of U.S. Central Command. His replacement will be Gen. Ray Odierno, now the war commander in Iraq. Odierno's job will be to eliminate his own office, officials said.

Sen. Mark Warner, Virginia junior senator and the state's former governor, said he saw "no rational basis" for dismantling Joint Forces Command because its mission was to impose "greater cooperation and savings among the military services."

"One thing I learned in the business world is you sometimes have to spend money to save money," Warner said. "It's a no-brainer that JFCOM is one of the commands that could use more resources."

The plan Gates will outline is similar to one suggested last month by the Defense Business Board, a panel of company executives who advise the Pentagon. The board said Gates should cut the number of civilian employees by at least 15 percent. The panel also identified Joint Forces Command as contributing to much of the contractor bloat because it had more contractors than government employees on its payroll.

Associated Press
August 09, 2010

[HermanB]

Ach die aankopen van dergelijke landen zijn niet serieus te nemen, slechts mooie speeltjes voor de sjeik. In het verleden is gebleken dat drie kwart van dergelijke aankopen binnen no time aan de grond staat.

[IPA NG]

Waarom niet allebei?

30 toestellen is erg mager.
Of moet ik die 11 Hawks meetellen?

Je bedoelt 30 EF's? Er komen er mogelijk 85 vrij, dus dat is voorlopig wel genoeg voor ons, lijkt me.

37 tranche 3 in DE,
48 tranche 3 in UK,

Nee voor Oman.
12 F-16's en 18 nieuwe toestellen naast 11 Hawks.

Nu vind ik 12 eigenlijk al te weinig voor een volwaardig squadron maar goed Oman is een klein land.

Ik heb liever niet dat NL de EF gaat aanschaffen (liever F-16's). Natuurlijk, op papier is het een zeer goed toestel maar als ik het goed begrepen heb zijn de kosten per vlieguur enorm. En al het schaarse geld wat daarmee verspild word had gebruikt kunnen worden voor andere nuttige zaken. En dat is dus juist rede Nr. 1 waarom ik zo'n GNG fan ben. Weinig nadelen TOV de EF en veel voordelen.

@Dudge
Een stuk of 20 NH-90 TTH's voor een leuk prijsje zie ik wel zitten.

[Lex]

Bulgaria Wants To Cancel Orders For Helos, C-27s

SOFIA, Bulgaria - Bulgaria plans to cancel orders for three military helicopters and two transport planes from France's Eurocopter and Italy's Alenia in a bid to reduce costs, the country's defense minister said Aug. 4.

"Very hard negotiations are ahead," Defense Minister Anyu Angelov told a press conference.

Talks with Eurocopter already were underway about dropping three Panther helicopters from a 358 million euro ($473 million) order for six of the Panther AS323s for its navy and 12 Cougar AS352 choppers for the air force.

"Our aim is to refuse the last three Panther helicopters [from Eurocopter]," he added.

Bulgaria will push for the bank guarantee for the three cancelled helicopters to be used as payment for three Panthers that have already been delivered, he said.

Eleven Cougars and three Panthers have already been delivered.

Bulgaria will also seek to cut back its 91 million euro order for five C-27J Spartan transport aircraft from Italy's Alenia Aeronautica, Angelov said.

"With Alenia Aeronautica, we want to refuse the fourth and fifth aircraft on the contract and pay only for the third Spartan plane," the minister said.

He did not specify however how much money Bulgaria would be able to save by renegotiating the two deals.
"I cannot say if our proposals will be accepted," Angelov said.

Severely pinched by the economic crisis, Bulgaria's right-wing government has been seeking ways to cut spending and boost revenues in order to narrow its widening budget gap.

AGENCE FRANCE-PRESSE
Published: 4 Aug 2010 13:15

[Elzenga]

Je bedoelt 30 EF's? Er komen er mogelijk 85 vrij, dus dat is voorlopig wel genoeg voor ons, lijkt me.

37 tranche 3 in DE,
48 tranche 3 in UK,

daar moet door een goede onderhandelaar toch een erg scherpe deal te sluiten zijn...zij willen er erg graag vanaf, wij willen een goed toestel voor een scherpe prijs. Het zal me echter niets verbazen als men zo'n buitenkansje laat lopen en stug blijf vasthouden aan de JSF. Zelfs als de Britten die zouden annuleren en het nog veel duurder wordt.

[IPA NG]

Waarom niet allebei?

30 toestellen is erg mager.
Of moet ik die 11 Hawks meetellen?

[Elzenga]

Ik vind het een logische keuze van Oman. Ze hebben immers al F-16s en om nu perse Britse toestellen te kopen als politiek gebaar...lijkt me in deze tijden van economische teruggang niet wenselijk. Laat Nederland zijn oog eens gaan over die Eurofighters...als ook de optie om een aantal nieuwe F-16s te kopen ter vervanging van de echt aan vervanging toe zijnde oudere exemplaren. De productielijn is blijkbaar nog wel even open.

[Lex]

In fresh blow to Eurofighter, US touts possible F-16 sale to Oman

US defence officials have confirmed that Oman has asked for a potential sale of 18 Lockheed Martin F-16 Block 50/52 fighters for $3.5 billion in a move that dampens the UK government's hopes to offload a batch of new Eurofighter Typhoons.

The US Defense Security Cooperation Agency (DSCA) informed Congress on 3 August that the Royal Air Force of Oman is seeking a "possible" F-16 purchase, which is most likely aimed at replacing its remaining Sepecat Jaguars. Fifteeen are still in operation, as listed in Flightglobal's MiliCAS database.

The announcement comes five years after Oman purchased a batch of 12 F-16 Block 50s, which are powered by the General Electric F110-GE-129 engine.

The DSCA says the potential second batch of F-16s could be Block 50s or Block 52s. The latter is powered by the Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-229 engine. The deal also would include the ITT advanced integrated defence electronic warfare suites (AIDEWS) and Northrop Grumman APG-68(V)9 radar.

If the contract is signed, Oman would give Lockheed a fresh boost in the region as the manufacturer seeks to close more F-16 deals with Qatar and Iraq.

But a contract signing for F-16s would mark a surprise reversal for the UK government, which indicated in April that a Typhoon sale in Muscat could be imminent. UK officials hope to offload some of the aircraft that the government is committed to buying during the Tranche 2 or Tranche 3A production phases of the Eurofighter programme.

UK Trade & Investment's Defence and Security Organisation says discussions have continued since the announcement earlier this year, but that it is "up to the government of Oman to determine the timeframe for its requirement".

Meanwhile, the F-16 programme remains in demand despite the arrival in six years of its successor the F-35A. On 20 July, Lockheed officials noted the F-16 has a firm backlog of 86 F-16s, including 20 fighters recently ordered as part of Egypt's sixth follow-on order.

The production line in Fort Worth, Texas, is expected to continue through 2013, with new deals possibly extending the programme for several years beyond, Lockheed says.

As a member of the six-nation Gulf Cooperation Council, Oman has joined a regional arms race as tensions with Iran escalate across the Strait of Hormuz.

04/08/10
Flight International

[IPA NG]

Ziek.